Episode 13

Rewriting the Police Narrative: A Conversation with Neil Gross

Published on: 22nd May, 2025

What lessons can be learned from cities that have successfully reformed their police cultures?

In this episode, guest Neil Gross and your hosts discuss police culture and the challenges of reform. Neil shares insights from his book Walk the Walk, which examines how three police departments have successfully shifted their approaches to policing. 


Today’s guest didn’t just study policing—he lived it. A former officer turned sociologist, Neil now teaches at Colby College, researching how police culture can change for the better. 


Topics that Chief Mike Butler, Dr. Carol Engel-Enright, Kristin Daley, and Neil Gross explore in this episode: 


(01:00) The Origins of Walk the Walk

* Why Neil decided to write about police culture and reform.


(10:30) Finding Models of Police Reform

* How Neil identified departments making positive changes.

* The key elements that made the police departments in Stockton (California), Longmont (Colorado), and LaGrange (Georgia) stand out.


(20:45) The Role of Training and Mindset

* The impact of traditional police training on officers’ mentalities.

* The balance between officer safety and community trust.


(30:20) Changing Police Culture from the Inside

* The importance of leadership in shaping department culture.

* What’s next for police reform efforts?

* How communities and officers can work together to create safer cities.


Thanks to Neil Gross for coming on the show. Learn more about Neil: https://neilgross.com/ 


Get Neil’s book, Walk the Walk: How Three Police Chiefs Defied the Odds and Changed Cop Culture: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1250777526 


This episode of Beyond the Bandaids is brought to you by Project PACT (Police And Community Together). Learn more about Project PACT by visiting https://projectpact.org/ 


LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/project-pact-police-and-community-together/about/ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/project_pact_org/ 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/project.pact/ 

Newsletter: https://projectpact.org/our-courses/ 


Contact Us: https://projectpact.org/contact-us/ 


Connect with the co-hosts of Beyond the Bandaids:


Chief Mike Butler on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-butler-6b0b2587/ 


Dr. Carol Engel-Enright on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/carol-engel-enright-97701a10/ 


Kristin Daley on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristin-daley-23bb7b26b/ 


The following three organizations—each committed to enhancing community well-being and policing integrity—joined forces to create Project PACT. 


Law Enforcement Action Partnership (LEAP): https://lawenforcementactionpartnership.org/ 

New Blue: https://newblue.org/ 

The School of Statesmanship, Stewardship & Service (SOSSAS): https://sossas.org/ 


Beyond the Bandaids is dedicated to exploring how police officers, public safety professionals, community leaders, and community members can reconnect with their sense of purpose and inspire positive change in their local community.


Subscribe via Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3Fd6ngx 

Subscribe via Spotify: https://spoti.fi/4h8puWm 

Subscribe via YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ProjectPACT-org 


This episode was produced by Story On Media: https://www.storyon.co/ 

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About the Podcast

Beyond the Bandaids with Project PACT
Welcome to Beyond the Bandaids with Project PACT, a podcast dedicated to exploring how police officers, public safety professionals, community leaders, and community members can reconnect with their sense of purpose and inspire positive change in their local community.

Through meaningful conversations and insights from experts, this podcast emphasizes that both citizens and police are part of the community, aiming to foster unity and build trust through partnership.

Beyond the Bandaids helps you rediscover this purpose and make a real difference by looking within and fostering deeper community connections. Instead of focusing on symptoms or past problems, we concentrate on creating a future where lasting, positive changes are not just possible, but probable.

For community members, Beyond the Bandaids offers a hopeful perspective on collaboration and compassion. Together, we can create vibrant, thriving neighborhoods where everyone plays a role in public safety and well-being. Join us as we explore transformative conversations and pave the way for a safer, more harmonious future for all.

Beyond the Bandaids is brought to you in partnership with the Law Enforcement Action Partnership, New Blue, and The School of Statesmanship, Stewardship, and Service (SOSSAS).

About your host

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Seth Silvers